Express your opinion!

krawehl wrote:

Boboknack wrote:

"Dark players don't cheat coz they don't PvP" remember that comment Strachu(by you!).

You make as much sense as a package of sausages'.

But I'm glad you want something done about the imbalance!   

Certain dark players have used the good old fallacy of premature generalization to badmouth pvp based on the misconduct of a few individuals. Certain dark players have also tried to govern how other dark players should play the game because they considered pvp to be an ineffective way of cp generation. IIRC that didn't end so well.

So that's the context and suggesting that Strachu is in any way apologetic of cheating is beyond ridiculous, and bringing this up in this thread is an act of trolling conducive to derailing efforts by players of both factions to solve the balancing problem.

Failing to understand there is a issue and blaming the dark faction for not doing their job right, I think is a joke, and I call that massive troll overkill.(I can only judge a person on what they say or do on the chats!)

No one on the dark side should tell other people how to play the game, you are right about that.   

I don't think I've tried derailing the efforts of solving the balancing issues, If you find that I'm negative then fine, I can live with that(but I've been negative on the forum). All I ask for is some common sense or this game will turn into a barren wasteland!("Its like penalty for light faction" this is what we are up against! all the while the dark player base is withering away)

Strachu has suggested, rightfully, that the current state of the dark faction is not merely the result of a lack of devine intervention, but also the responsibility of the dark faction. Understanding that may help you getting back on your feet. Constantly telling everyone that it's all oh so unfair and looking for ways to assign blame will not help you with player retention. (I don't just mean you personally here, I know you've been doing your best to help people.)

We all agree that the current imbalance needs to be addressed. But darkies aren't helping themselves if they fail to understand that they lost fair and square because the population surplus was in no small part the result of deliberate efforts of major light guilds.

We've started thinking strategically about retaining more new players than the dark faction during a seemingly eternal stalemate and in the light of the noobswarms that took place more than half a year ago. The strategy worked.

So try to learn from our success  

And comment on Strachu's idea of faction points or any other idea that you may find promising, otherwise the two of us may be accused of derailing the thread   

Boboknack wrote:

"Dark players don't cheat coz they don't PvP" remember that comment Strachu(by you!).

You make as much sense as a package of sausages'.

But I'm glad you want something done about the imbalance!   

i just don't understand what is wrong with doing pvp, why you accuse other players of cheating, just because they pvp?
you can do as many pvp as you want to, and when i lvl up my units we can try t2 just for fun nothing else

Strachu wrote:

Boboknack wrote:

"Dark players don't cheat coz they don't PvP" remember that comment Strachu(by you!).

You make as much sense as a package of sausages'.

But I'm glad you want something done about the imbalance!   

i just don't understand what is wrong with doing pvp, why you accuse other players of cheating, just because they pvp?
you can do as many pvp as you want to, and when i lvl up my units we can try t2 just for fun nothing else

There is nothing wrong with doing PvP!  

There is something wrong with Light players cheating in PvP!(Admitting it on forum and on the various chats!)  

There is also something wrong when Light players are willing to buy the frags the cheaters are selling.(or getting gl's sent to them by the cheaters for no apparent reason)  

When this got addressed on global chat you came up with the answer "Darks don't cheat coz they don't PvP"? That is why I say you make no sense and it doesn't do wonders to your credibility(in my opinion!).

If you like to PvP then fine, you are free to do so. I have no problem with that!   

krawehl wrote:

Strachu has suggested, rightfully, that the current state of the dark faction is not merely the result of a lack of devine intervention, but also the responsibility of the dark faction. Understanding that may help you getting back on your feet. Constantly telling everyone that it's all oh so unfair and looking for ways to assign blame will not help you with player retention. (I don't just mean you personally here, I know you've been doing your best to help people.)

The CP bonus the Light got every time we made more cps, I'd call divine intervention!(We are on the Hades map after all) We have in fact been getting punished for making more cps when the Light faction have been lazy although you have been outnumbering us! I say make it fair and let the active players reap the rewards(dark or light) - that statement have been met with Light faction crying about certain dark players making more cps and not having 2 or 3 jobs and I know what not - I would call that derailing and it has almost derailed the game itself!

We all agree that the current imbalance needs to be addressed. But darkies aren't helping themselves if they fail to understand that they lost fair and square because the population surplus was in no small part the result of deliberate efforts of major light guilds.

If I recall correctly we were pushing the Light faction back and aiming for the Light Capital, then something fell apart. We did not lose fair and square, because it became evident during the last map that we could not win. Every time we made an effort the Light side would be rewarded with a CP bonus and thus resulting in us being pushed back further than the regions we'd just claimed. Dark players stopped playing because the game lost its purpose! Imbalance or no imbalance, the game will still suffer from the decease of not rewarding effort. That is why dark players have left the game and that is why the Light faction will most likely win again, there is no one to fight you anymore other than some lonely samurais that won't give up(Cudos goes out to them!)!

We've started thinking strategically about retaining more new players than the dark faction during a seemingly eternal stalemate and in the light of the noobswarms that took place more than half a year ago. The strategy worked.

How do you know what we as a faction did or did not do to retain more new players? Could we have done anything else than telling them to join the guild that appealed to them the most, giving them equipment, encouraging them to join the co-op queue or providing them with resources to upgrade buildings et cetera?

So try to learn from our success 

Success? It has been a no contest fight for a while, your opponents simply didn't bother showing up

And comment on Strachu's idea of faction points or any other idea that you may find promising, otherwise the two of us may be accused of derailing the thread   

Well as I've stated before, I believe our guild has done everything in its power to keep new players playing(I don't see how other dark guilds have failed in that either?). I guess that would reward us with some points if it was up to Strachu. What those points would do, I don't know?

But I do hope this mess get's sorted out, before its to late. The game deserves it!  

Strachu wrote:

In some reasons dark faction should blame themselves for huge imbalance. Light faction is working hard to keep new players, what about darkies? We have a problem coz darkies are weak, cp bonus wont help, 10 darkies fighting against 200 lightis, is it good idea? They wont be interested to attract the game to new players. What about mixing races? Maybe new system?

It is convenient to blame the Faction that has less players for not retaining them...it's an easy thing to do.

Last time I checked there has NEVER been a prolonged period of time in which more players joined the Dark Faction than the Light Faction.

The reality is that the Light has the luxury of retaining less players, proportionately, than the Dark does in order to maintain a competitive balance.

This isn't me inventing something, this is me closely observing 'noobs' as informed by the rankings.

Your comments assume an equal playing field from the beginning, which I can assure you has not been the case.

I'm more disappointed than anything... for all of the outcry about how many Light players left due to the AI armies, often this was met by understanding and sympathy by your Dark counterparts and acknowledgement that this would be a morale blow that would indeed lead to Light players leaving. It would have been easy for me to come out and say "In some reasons Light faction should blame themselves for huge player loss. Dark faction is working hard to keep new players, what about lighties?"

Now, is player retention one of the responsibilities of the Dark Faction? Yes, but let's not pretend that both sides have an equally easy/difficult time in doing so.

---

Oh, and by the way:

Shortly, after Hades launched, for every Dark player that got to 20CPs there were more than 1.45 Lights.

Shortly after this cycle started that 1:1.45 ratio was at 1:1.3....in other words, it might be that over time Light players have done a worse job in retaining players.

That 1:1.3 ratio grows worse nearly daily...and that has to do with new members.

Let's be realistic here, there aren't going to be any significant increases in new players for either side any time soon. That's simply the way it is right now, its out of our hands short of word of mouth passing to friends and individual advertising.

Instead of bickering over the ratios and who's fault it is, we need to constructively find ways of retaining the people we do have, and bringing back people who have stopped playing back into the fold with a general overhaul of what a faction is. To do this we need to come up with something dynamic that keeps people interested and active. This kind of BS in such a public way is what pushes people away and wastes everyone's time. 

Metalsiagon wrote:

Let's be realistic here, there aren't going to be any significant increases in new players for either side any time soon. That's simply the way it is right now, its out of our hands short of word of mouth passing to friends and individual advertising.

Instead of bickering over the ratios and who's fault it is, we need to constructively find ways of retaining the people we do have, and bringing back people who have stopped playing back into the fold with a general overhaul of what a faction is. To do this we need to come up with something dynamic that keeps people interested and active. This kind of BS in such a public way is what pushes people away and wastes everyone's time. 

Without this kind of BS, there would be no vent and more people would have left the game already. But you're right, all of this, is of course only words and sentences, action is required!

Metalsiagon wrote:

Instead of bickering over the ratios and who's fault it is, we need to constructively find ways of retaining the people we do have, and bringing back people who have stopped playing back into the fold with a general overhaul of what a faction is. To do this we need to come up with something dynamic that keeps people interested and active. This kind of BS in such a public way is what pushes people away and wastes everyone's time. 

You're right...I got emotional. I felt that the claim was cheap and incorrect... and then I went and responded childishly. My apologies for doing so...it isn't helping.

I am locking this thread, as the outcome is pretty clear.