dificulty changes, questions

Posts : 289 Join date : 2013-06-21

well, its easier but still tougher than before, and i guess more acceptable balance. lower level players seem to hold on fine with those helpers and coops no longer are an wipeout for them.

still questions remain... before the Friday update, heroes gear and i guess tech levels, would not increase the difficulty level of enemy armies. that meant that heroes and gear would help us defeat the enemy and make the battle easier although more expensive due repair costs. if this changed, then gear might not be a good option... questions:
1) does bringing on heroes generate more enemies?
2) does bringing on gear generate more enemies?
3)do tech levels that give armor or melee bonus, generate more enemies?

thanks!

Posts : 3124 Join date : 2012-11-13

nathor wrote:: 1) does bringing on heroes generate more enemies?
2) does bringing on gear generate more enemies?
3)do tech levels that give armor or melee bonus, generate more enemies?

No in all 3.

Posts : 289 Join date : 2013-06-21

nathor wrote:: well, its easier but still tougher than before, and i guess more acceptable balance. lower level players seem to hold on fine with those helpers and coops no longer are an wipeout for them.

i take this back, coop still too hard...

Posts : 511 Join date : 2013-05-08 Location : Amber Shores

Co-op is now the hardest mode (not counting pvp). It should have better rewards and CP gains than NM imo if it's going to stay like this.

Posts : 3124 Join date : 2012-11-13

CO-OP is not the hardest mode. Play more than 3-4 battles to get a feeling of a certain battle mode. CO-OP difficulty can vary depending on what you bring, what your ally brings and of course what you go up against.

Nightmare is always the hardest, in terms of lvl range and efficiency of the AI units.

CO-OP is probably the most random mode, in terms or difficulty, for the reasons described above...

Posts : 698 Join date : 2013-08-21

From my point of view:

Nightmare solo: now it doesnt take insanely long battles and kiting and splitting enemy in groups forever. Those tactics are still key for bad equipped units, overall it became maybe 10% easier.

Tower doesnt lose morale: very very very nasty units now, op giants once again. You took the one option everyone had to fight them and turned it to only ranged kills them. Low lvl units have no chance to kill it unless they shoot. Killing it with 1000 cuts pretty much a death sentence to many among own rows.

Coops: Assuming gear and heroes dont add more nastiness they got easier, about 10% maybe. But still a nightmare compared to what we had before the weekend. Its not a suicide when high lvl player and low lvl player get matched together anymore - good. Coops has always been the key aspect of the game for many players - being the endless option to gain ressources and advance. What people wanted was a slightly harder version of old coops and not a slightly softer version of "nightmare weekend" coops. Right now there are worlds between those two.

I was used to have 5-15 minutes to heal after battles. Now i need to wait 25-30 minutes for heals. There is now no possibility to play the game a lot in a limited time. While ppl were able to clear their cp within an hour or two, now - with 20+ min healing timers (or even more) it takes 3-5 hours to use all cp. Plenty waiting involved, far too much. Doing coops results in more casualties than solo nightmare, but the rewards arent matching it.

Suggestions:
- Reduce all healing by 30%
- Give for coops more rewards than for nightmare or at least the same
- Remove few enemy units from coops to make them easier

Posts : 3124 Join date : 2012-11-13

Tibr wrote:: Low lvl units have no chance to kill it unless they shoot. Killing it with 1000 cuts pretty much a death sentence to many among own rows.

I strongly disagree. I was taking down Giants with lvl 5 units (Dwarfs of course). Obviously, I used tactics to cope with this threat. Whoever charges straight forward with no tactics in mind will have probably the most casualties...

I always take care of low threats first and then I concentrate on the highest threats, such as Giants, Trolls and Ogres.

However, I have received several reports of players saying that in CO-OPs, in some cases, they have faced double the number of units they have with their ally combined....which is...wrong...Strike 1

Also, I understand the frustration with healing times...especially coming from veteran players with high level units and of course very high healing (waiting) times... Strike 2

As I mentioned in a PM, I am considering a very drastic change in the game, but more on that later on.... I have to consider the consequences of such a change in the gameplay...

The changes in the battle mechanics are surely a very big change in the game and they need fine tuning so battles can become solid, challenging but not suicidal and of course entertaining. Every single day we gather info by reading your feedback and every single day we make more adjustments. Expect more changes tomorrow.

Easy, Normal and Hard are good difficulties. Nightmare, it might not be so "nightmarish" as it should be... Smile

CO-OP needs some more love...I believe that if we take care of the issue of sometimes facing a huge enemy army, compared to the combined army the 2 players have in a CO-OP, it should become more balanced.

Posts : 698 Join date : 2013-08-21

I was doing a nm with cavs and li, taking best approach and lots of effort splitting enemy and taking it down bit by bit, all that by timing flanking and getting enemy to flee almost instantly - i had taken only 5 casualties so far. In the end i had only the lvl 7 giant left. Everything was again timed to hit it at once. He died, but before he killed two horses and 28 men. It feels a little disproportional, but time shall tell.

Indeed i had a coop just now, me 10 units and dakota 8 units. Enemy showed two rows of units from left to right - it seemed like 40 enemy units. It was a tedious victory, but good xp Smile

Posts : 830 Join date : 2013-08-23 Location : Australia

RuneSlayer wrote:

nathor wrote:: 1) does bringing on heroes generate more enemies?
2) does bringing on gear generate more enemies?
3)do tech levels that give armor or melee bonus, generate more enemies?

No in all 3.

I'm wanting to really understand this, as it seems to be the opposite of what I read somewhere else recently.

Are you saying that the AP generated by heroes and gear does not make the enemies you face harder?

So a level 5 Light Infantry unit on normal difficulty would face the same number and levels of enemies whether it was naked with no hero, or decked to its max gear score and WITH a hero?

Posts : 3124 Join date : 2012-11-13

http://www.battleconforum.com/t938-bug-causing-havoc-in-co-op-discovered

Sometimes, I REALLY hate bugs....

Posts : 830 Join date : 2013-08-23 Location : Australia

Cheers RuneSlayer Smile

Posts : 698 Join date : 2013-08-21

RuneSlayer wrote:

Tibr wrote:: Low lvl units have no chance to kill it unless they shoot. Killing it with 1000 cuts pretty much a death sentence to many among own rows.

I strongly disagree. I was taking down Giants with lvl 5 units (Dwarfs of course). Obviously, I used tactics to cope with this threat. Whoever charges straight forward with no tactics in mind will have probably the most casualties...

Tactics against a giant that is immune against flanking effects, anyone figured out how to deal with them apart of shooting?

I stand corrected, low lvls can kill it. Because it has the nasty skills only at higher lvls. I need to adjust my statement to

High lvl units have no chance to kill it unless they shoot (or get it to run with some miracles).

Since you took away the tower moral drop .. i sent 5 cavs and 3 li without on the spot timing but still very close to each other (all lvl9-11 units) against a lvl 9 giant. He killed 2 cavs, and all the rest fled from the smell. He was the last one standing and all my units were at 80% hp or even unharmed. I was patiently waiting for the timeout. All my efforts barely scratched the green from his skin - maybe 10 or 20% of his hp. While it was running before its now immortal from the moment it gets the nastly crush. Was it your intention to have ppl take out everything but the giant and wait for the timeout? Or maybe just focus on ranged? Because only one archer wont kill it before the timeout Very Happy

Posts : 3124 Join date : 2012-11-13

Tibr......Cavalry units CANNOT tank... You are sending a shock unit against a Giant? That is a No-No tactic...

Posts : 698 Join date : 2013-08-21

So you imply the crush ability is not a 360° attack and one has to front it with one overtanked high morale HI while stabbing with everything else in the back - and the giant doesn´t switch targets untill they run or die? Because not even capped gl HI can kill it 1v1 from what i hear. This makes many tactics and setups obsolete and considering the uberlong heal timers on HI .. ranged units are much easier to come by.
And one can face two giants in the same game. Which requires several HI units already, whenever there is a giant, games turn hardcore instead of casual right now Wink

Posts : 142 Join date : 2013-07-12

Tibr wrote:: Because not even capped gl HI can kill it 1v1 from what i hear.

If you are refering to what I posted somewhere on this forum, it was capped LI, not HI.

After reading Rune post somewhere, I applied the same tactic he described : taking care of the whole army and keeping the giant for the end of the battle then swarming him from all side with several units (half naked / half geared nothing specially powerful) and it dies pretty fast.

It is way more powerful than other mercs but if you can keep it for the end you can kill it in melee without taking too much damage. You need several units though (I had maybe 7-8 ).

I'm still pretty worried about balance when GW2 will come and it will be handle by other players, but what Rune said is true.

Posts : 698 Join date : 2013-08-21

Dwarven hi may be able to tank it in full gl for a bit. One high elven player is facing lvl 12+ giants and his capped HI are cracking like chips against it.

Posts : 289 Join date : 2013-06-21

RuneSlayer wrote:: Tibr......Cavalry units CANNOT tank... You are sending a shock unit against a Giant? That is a No-No tactic...

6 cavs, 1 giant, 5 seconds and the giant flees. seems simple...
of course, i would not send 1 cav to hold the giant, that is silly.

Posts : 3124 Join date : 2012-11-13

Have you faced a lvl 12+ Giant?

Posts : 289 Join date : 2013-06-21

RuneSlayer wrote:: Have you faced a lvl 12+ Giant?

my max is 10 or 11 i think... dies the same way...

Posts : 142 Join date : 2013-07-12

Tibr wrote:: Dwarven hi may be able to tank it in full gl for a bit. One high elven player is facing lvl 12+ giants and his capped HI are cracking like chips against it.

Oh yeah... level 12+ giants. Never saw those so high level. Must be insanely hard to deal with.

And I don't think dwarven HI can tank it much better than elven HI tbh. Wasn't aware of anyone else testing it 1 vs 1 so I though you might be refering what I posted somewhere else. Well I was wrong :p

RuneSlayer wrote:: Have you faced a lvl 12+ Giant?

Pretty sure he's talking about Dakota.

Posts : 451 Join date : 2013-05-26

i belive giant escaped due to impact damage. Not everyone has such luxury Smile

Posts : 698 Join date : 2013-08-21

Yes, i can make the giant run with impact damage as an elf. But hearing what other race players said i tried to simulate it. Going on the giant with charge on cooldown - the result was megabad as described above.

Posts : 3124 Join date : 2012-11-13

I love Giants...

Posts : 61 Join date : 2013-07-29

RuneSlayer wrote:: Also, I understand the frustration with healing times...especially coming from veteran players with high level units and of course very high healing (waiting) times... Strike 2

As I mentioned in a PM, I am considering a very drastic change in the game, but more on that later on.... I have to consider the consequences of such a change in the gameplay...

One very nice way of seeing the whole healing thing change would be allowing them to auto heal with no gold, and gold would triple the heal times.

That might be out of balance but something along those lines I think people could live with.

Why I bring this up is because I am tired of having a 14 gold smelter with 13 others and still needing bloody gold for every little task I do around the keep. :/

Also, I love giants. The only times I fought them they pretty much stall in the back and stand there until I basically obliterate the rest of the army and then my archers begin pelting it with arrows and kiting it until it dies. (Anyone that hates kiting, it's a tactic, it works, use it.)